Dynamic pricing is one of the biggest scams in ticketing we've seen in a very long time. Live Nation keep claiming "Not our fault. The artist determines this🤷♂️", but my experience in purchasing Crowded House tickets calls this into question.
When the Auckland concert first went on sale, the dynamic pricing had the best seats at the front of Spark Arena on sale from $400-$500. We managed to purchase our seats via the artist pre-sale rather than the Ticketmaster one. Net result: front row seats for $200.
For many weeks afterwards, the seats directly behind us, and going back for quite a few rows, were still being sold at the "Demand" price of $400.
I love that Ticketmaster points the finger at the artists, and the artists point their fingers at their management, who then turn and point their fingers at Ticketmaster.
The problem is the only way to say no is to stop buying tickets. But we're talking about fandom here: people will pay to see their favourite artists.
When does exploitation become extortion? I feel like we've found that line eh.
> exactly how much of what’s happening in Australia is happening here too?
I'll take '100% of it, all of it, and its even easier here because we're even smaller than AUS' thanks Chris.
I'm in the final leg of Michael Azerrad's hefty tome Our Band Could Be Your Life and its interesting how much of what we're saying, and what Robert Smith is saying, is the same as what bands like Fugazi have been saying for forty years: Fugazi famously stipulated $5 tickets for all ages shows as they were coming up, and singer Ian Mackaye did the management and bookings himself, because he could see that bands were being taken advantage of by management, promoters, venues, everything.
Coppel is nervous because he's a corporate figurehead of a creative industry; a theatre nerd representing a live music industry he probably doesn't understand for a company that is probably sitting on him to squeeze profits; an old man who is wildly out of touch with the people who are actually affected by the decisions the company he represents are making. I'd be interested to know when the last time Michael Coppel actually went to some basement rock venue and watched a band with two dozen other people. Because that's what he is killing.
Oh, if you're a music fan who grew up on 90s punk, grunge and hardcore, I recommend all four of these brilliant music books I've read this year: 1) Kelefa Sanneh's Major Labels: A History of Popular Music in Seven Genres' 2) Michael Azerrad's Our Band Could Be Your Life: Scenes from the American Indie Underground 1981-1991 (worth it just for the chapter on the Butthole Surfers); 3) Dan Ozzi's Sellout: The Major-Label Feeding Frenzy That Swept Punk, Emo, and Hardcore (1994–2007), and 4) Rob Harvilla's 60 Songs That Explain the '90s (essentially a cut down of the podcast). And I'd recommend them in that order, I think.
Also, thoroughly recommend taking the audiobook of Azerrad - each chapter is read by an artist who was influenced by the band in the chapter (Slipknot's Corey Taylor reads about Big Black, The Decemberists' Colin Meloy reads about Husker Du, Sharon Van Etten reads about Dinosaur Jr). Bonus fun: listen to the music as you go as well (also fun with the other books).
BTW I'm not so surprised to hear bands like KoRn and Slipknot are skipping NZ due to festival commitments - that has been going on forever (remember the old Soundwave lineups we never got to see any of in NZ). And having come from a smaller centre - like you - I can remember being jealous of Auckland. This feels like a bigger version of that. Its the really big solo tours that are concerning to me, the ones where the tour plan simply skipped us.
Agreed, that's very true. But this feels like it's on a much bigger scale right now. Green Day, The Killers, Katy Perry, Billie Eilish have ALWAYS come here. If they're levelling up and only playing large-scale stadium shows, we're going to keep missing out on them because we don't have the facilities to put them in.
Meanwhile, even the mid-tier acts are bypassing us. Acts like Supergrass, Jack White and Primal Scream would always come play shows in the Powerstation.
(Would kill to see that new Jack White album live!)
It’s ironic that I’m stumping up money to Pearl Jam with Ticketmaster for November. Remember they tried to take them on in the 90s and even tried an alternative tour without them. This led to chaos and the band basically throwing their hands up because no one else would join their boycott.
Thank god people are finally realising what I have been trying to tell you all for so long - Live Nation have no idea what they are doing, and Live Nation AIPAC and their employees have rorted the entire live music industry to the point where it has become wholly unpleasant to engage. I am deeply ashamed of the people who willingly work for this company and the people who play defense for them. I am not angry for no reason, they killed the careers of everyone I know while I got to thrive and grow. How could this not upset me, why would no one want to go on the record about it? What kind of fool is afraid of their peers?
Well, who knows, but if there is any class conscious left in the so called “alternative music scene” then one would expect that a reckoning will come. Personally, I will never debase myself again by stepping foot in San Fran, and it perplexes me that much of the Wellington music scene still puts up with them.
So long as “indie music” is an easily attainable studio sound and not a definitional concept, there is no way forward for underground music culture in NZ as I see it. Everything recorded at Roundhead sounds identically bad, the government gives funding to the bands who are not allowed to keep any of it and so they are not allowed to grow. Much of the NZ On Air funding seems to end up already in the pockets of adjacent industry figures instead of the musicians to who the grants were made to, what the fuck???? Who is watching all these music videos, and are they really more interesting than whatever scraps the author could cobble together themselves? Does alternative music ever sound good when it is recorded in a professional music studio? For me, the answers to these questions are obvious because I like to see the fight and the struggle to create.
Give a man a damn fish and he’ll eat a fish. Give a man 1500NZD and he will buy a second hand MPC. Capital, free time and access is the fundamental issue.
There isn't much I don't get about modern music but Bon Iver and the fact that they seem to enjoy both credibility and connections I find truly mystifying. Do they come from money or music royalty or something?
Dynamic pricing is one of the biggest scams in ticketing we've seen in a very long time. Live Nation keep claiming "Not our fault. The artist determines this🤷♂️", but my experience in purchasing Crowded House tickets calls this into question.
When the Auckland concert first went on sale, the dynamic pricing had the best seats at the front of Spark Arena on sale from $400-$500. We managed to purchase our seats via the artist pre-sale rather than the Ticketmaster one. Net result: front row seats for $200.
For many weeks afterwards, the seats directly behind us, and going back for quite a few rows, were still being sold at the "Demand" price of $400.
I love that Ticketmaster points the finger at the artists, and the artists point their fingers at their management, who then turn and point their fingers at Ticketmaster.
The problem is the only way to say no is to stop buying tickets. But we're talking about fandom here: people will pay to see their favourite artists.
When does exploitation become extortion? I feel like we've found that line eh.
> exactly how much of what’s happening in Australia is happening here too?
I'll take '100% of it, all of it, and its even easier here because we're even smaller than AUS' thanks Chris.
I'm in the final leg of Michael Azerrad's hefty tome Our Band Could Be Your Life and its interesting how much of what we're saying, and what Robert Smith is saying, is the same as what bands like Fugazi have been saying for forty years: Fugazi famously stipulated $5 tickets for all ages shows as they were coming up, and singer Ian Mackaye did the management and bookings himself, because he could see that bands were being taken advantage of by management, promoters, venues, everything.
Coppel is nervous because he's a corporate figurehead of a creative industry; a theatre nerd representing a live music industry he probably doesn't understand for a company that is probably sitting on him to squeeze profits; an old man who is wildly out of touch with the people who are actually affected by the decisions the company he represents are making. I'd be interested to know when the last time Michael Coppel actually went to some basement rock venue and watched a band with two dozen other people. Because that's what he is killing.
That figure of 1300 small venue closers is STAGGERING. That's like total decimation.
I hear the same kind of defensive talk coming out of the supermarket duopoly that I deal with in my day job. It really rankles me eh.
I need to read that book!
Oh, if you're a music fan who grew up on 90s punk, grunge and hardcore, I recommend all four of these brilliant music books I've read this year: 1) Kelefa Sanneh's Major Labels: A History of Popular Music in Seven Genres' 2) Michael Azerrad's Our Band Could Be Your Life: Scenes from the American Indie Underground 1981-1991 (worth it just for the chapter on the Butthole Surfers); 3) Dan Ozzi's Sellout: The Major-Label Feeding Frenzy That Swept Punk, Emo, and Hardcore (1994–2007), and 4) Rob Harvilla's 60 Songs That Explain the '90s (essentially a cut down of the podcast). And I'd recommend them in that order, I think.
Also, thoroughly recommend taking the audiobook of Azerrad - each chapter is read by an artist who was influenced by the band in the chapter (Slipknot's Corey Taylor reads about Big Black, The Decemberists' Colin Meloy reads about Husker Du, Sharon Van Etten reads about Dinosaur Jr). Bonus fun: listen to the music as you go as well (also fun with the other books).
(*logs into the library app*)
BTW I'm not so surprised to hear bands like KoRn and Slipknot are skipping NZ due to festival commitments - that has been going on forever (remember the old Soundwave lineups we never got to see any of in NZ). And having come from a smaller centre - like you - I can remember being jealous of Auckland. This feels like a bigger version of that. Its the really big solo tours that are concerning to me, the ones where the tour plan simply skipped us.
Agreed, that's very true. But this feels like it's on a much bigger scale right now. Green Day, The Killers, Katy Perry, Billie Eilish have ALWAYS come here. If they're levelling up and only playing large-scale stadium shows, we're going to keep missing out on them because we don't have the facilities to put them in.
Meanwhile, even the mid-tier acts are bypassing us. Acts like Supergrass, Jack White and Primal Scream would always come play shows in the Powerstation.
(Would kill to see that new Jack White album live!)
It’s ironic that I’m stumping up money to Pearl Jam with Ticketmaster for November. Remember they tried to take them on in the 90s and even tried an alternative tour without them. This led to chaos and the band basically throwing their hands up because no one else would join their boycott.
Almost 30 years later and it’s even worse.
Same :(
Thank god people are finally realising what I have been trying to tell you all for so long - Live Nation have no idea what they are doing, and Live Nation AIPAC and their employees have rorted the entire live music industry to the point where it has become wholly unpleasant to engage. I am deeply ashamed of the people who willingly work for this company and the people who play defense for them. I am not angry for no reason, they killed the careers of everyone I know while I got to thrive and grow. How could this not upset me, why would no one want to go on the record about it? What kind of fool is afraid of their peers?
It’s a pretty stark watch eh. Question is, will it change anything now it’s out in the open? Can anything be done at this point?
Well, who knows, but if there is any class conscious left in the so called “alternative music scene” then one would expect that a reckoning will come. Personally, I will never debase myself again by stepping foot in San Fran, and it perplexes me that much of the Wellington music scene still puts up with them.
So long as “indie music” is an easily attainable studio sound and not a definitional concept, there is no way forward for underground music culture in NZ as I see it. Everything recorded at Roundhead sounds identically bad, the government gives funding to the bands who are not allowed to keep any of it and so they are not allowed to grow. Much of the NZ On Air funding seems to end up already in the pockets of adjacent industry figures instead of the musicians to who the grants were made to, what the fuck???? Who is watching all these music videos, and are they really more interesting than whatever scraps the author could cobble together themselves? Does alternative music ever sound good when it is recorded in a professional music studio? For me, the answers to these questions are obvious because I like to see the fight and the struggle to create.
Best comment on Substack in my lifetime
Give a man a damn fish and he’ll eat a fish. Give a man 1500NZD and he will buy a second hand MPC. Capital, free time and access is the fundamental issue.
There isn't much I don't get about modern music but Bon Iver and the fact that they seem to enjoy both credibility and connections I find truly mystifying. Do they come from money or music royalty or something?